2019-2020 Stars Regular Season Thread

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Re: 2019-2020 Stars Regular Season Thread

Postby Troy McClure » Wed Oct 16, 2019 7:28 pm

ScubaSteve wrote:Is there a generational talent in the draft this year worth tanking for? Asking for a friend.

There’s a French Canadian center who looks like the obvious #1 pick. He’d probably be the second best forward on the Stars even right now.

https://theqmjhl.ca/players/16991
Last edited by Troy McClure on Wed Oct 16, 2019 7:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 2019-2020 Stars Regular Season Thread

Postby Troy McClure » Wed Oct 16, 2019 7:29 pm

Oh *poo poo*. We’re about to see Perry go murder someone.
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Re: 2019-2020 Stars Regular Season Thread

Postby Troy McClure » Wed Oct 16, 2019 10:29 pm

Kinda wonder if the league is calling around looking for an alternative Winter Classic host. Can’t imagine NBC is eager to put a team that is 29th in the league in points percentage and dead *fargin'* last in goal scoring on as their biggest game of the regular season.
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Re: 2019-2020 Stars Regular Season Thread

Postby Math » Thu Oct 17, 2019 8:12 am

Troy McClure wrote:
ScubaSteve wrote:Is there a generational talent in the draft this year worth tanking for? Asking for a friend.

There’s a French Canadian center who looks like the obvious #1 pick. He’d probably be the second best forward on the Stars even right now.

https://theqmjhl.ca/players/16991


Yes, the Alexis Lafrenière guy. From what I saw, good hands, lot of speed. Similar skills, stats and stuff than KcKinnon and Drouin during their junior years. My only concern about him: A potential Drouin 2.0, in other words what's between his two shoulders.

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Re: 2019-2020 Stars Regular Season Thread

Postby Troy McClure » Thu Oct 17, 2019 8:44 am

Math wrote:
Troy McClure wrote:
ScubaSteve wrote:Is there a generational talent in the draft this year worth tanking for? Asking for a friend.

There’s a French Canadian center who looks like the obvious #1 pick. He’d probably be the second best forward on the Stars even right now.

https://theqmjhl.ca/players/16991


Yes, the Alexis Lafrenière guy. From what I saw, good hands, lot of speed. Similar skills, stats and stuff than KcKinnon and Drouin during their junior years. My only concern about him: A potential Drouin 2.0, in other words what's between his two shoulders.

Here's the list of players drafted out of the QMJHL by the Stars:

2013 2nd round Desrosiers Goalie (Quebecois)
2011 5th round Vance D (American)
2006 1st round Vishnevskiy D (Russian)
2003 6th round Wathier LW (Ontario)
2002 1st round Vagner D (Czech)
2001 9th round Sullivan RW (Newfie)
1999 5th round Baumgartner RW (Austrian)
1995 2nd round Cote LW (Quebecois)
1995 5th round Marleau D (Quebecois)

Only nine players ever drafted out of the Q, and of those nine, only three are actually French Canadian.

Don't know what to take from this, but it sure seems like the Stars ignore the Q.
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Re: 2019-2020 Stars Regular Season Thread

Postby ScubaSteve » Thu Oct 17, 2019 9:13 am

Not a great list when the most successful pick is Francis Wathier.
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Re: 2019-2020 Stars Regular Season Thread

Postby Math » Thu Oct 17, 2019 10:12 am

Troy McClure wrote: Here's the list of players drafted out of the QMJHL by the Stars:

2013 2nd round Desrosiers Goalie (Quebecois)
2011 5th round Vance D (American)
2006 1st round Vishnevskiy D (Russian)
2003 6th round Wathier LW (Ontario)
2002 1st round Vagner D (Czech)
2001 9th round Sullivan RW (Newfie)
1999 5th round Baumgartner RW (Austrian)
1995 2nd round Cote LW (Quebecois)
1995 5th round Marleau D (Quebecois)

Only nine players ever drafted out of the Q, and of those nine, only three are actually French Canadian.

Don't know what to take from this, but it sure seems like the Stars ignore the Q.


Yes, and I would say it's a major trend not only in the Stars' organization, but also around the league. There's less Quebecers that are drafted and make through the NHL on a regular basis, that pretty noticeable.

The league development and expansion come with a much wider player basin all across North America, trending up especially in former non-traditional markets. Dallas is one of the best example when you see the evolution between the early 90's and now. Moreover, there seem to be more interests towards European players where they used to be simply ignored. As a consequence, the fraction of Quebecers are decreasing, the pool of eligible players is much wider.

But my other hypothesis is related to the mental aspects of QC players towards, let's say Canadian in general. There's (and there will always be, even unconsciously) an inferiority or persecution complex coming from a looooong time ago, when the Brits kicked French's asses in the Plains of Abraham. Basically, nothing is their fault. When they are challenged, instead of listening to criticizm and work to improve, they will whine and complain. And I have the feeling that more and more scouting staff all across the league become somehow reluctant to consider a Quebecers vs. another player coming from elsewhere at equal value and skill.

I remember being in the press-box at a Quebec Remparts game. One Stars scout was next to me and came to see Anthony Duclair. Well, we probably saw the same thing: that guy was by far the best one ice, was the quickest, great vision, great hands, lot of potential, sometimes putting maybe too much sauce. However, one thing was lacking: he didn't have a brain. He got tickled a bit and totally lost it, trying to instigate fights before being sent off. Ok, Duclair-Stars, stikethrough.

Another symptomatic example I have is the game #7 between the Sharks and the Golden Knights with the famous 5' major that turned into four goals. Typical Québec reaction came from Marchessault (I'm pissed, refs robbed us, this is a scandal), barking indistinctly at everyone while other players took that on them (Yes It was a bad call, but allowing four goals during the penalty is unacceptable, it's on us). Of course they are not all like that, Marc-André Fleury or Marc-Antoine Vlasic for instance, but you can see a general pattern.

Sorry for the novel and eventual syntax and/or grammatical errors.

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Re: 2019-2020 Stars Regular Season Thread

Postby slaps » Thu Oct 17, 2019 10:15 am

https://theathletic.com/1299357/2019/10/16/stars-20-20-early-season-hole-gets-even-deeper-as-stars-get-burned-on-nhl-goal-of-the-year/

The Dallas Stars have played eight games, tied for the most in the NHL thus far. They also have the 28th-most points and a 1-6-1 record.

It’s a deep hole the Stars will try to dig themselves out of with just under 90 percent of the season remaining.

If we use 93 points as the playoff cut line — that’s how many the Stars had as a wild-card team last season — Dallas would need to accumulate 90 points in their final 74 games. Realistically, that would require a record that would look something like 43-27-4 in the final 74 games.

That’s the equivalent of playing like a 100-point team for the remainder of the season. So the question becomes, can the Stars play like a top-five team in the league consistently starting Friday in Pittsburgh? The odds certainly aren’t in their favor.
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Re: 2019-2020 Stars Regular Season Thread

Postby Math » Thu Oct 17, 2019 10:33 am

And we still haven't played vs. Colorado, Nashville and only once vs. St-Louis (at least 12 games), considering that Winnipeg has no defense and arguably sucks. Those 4-point games will be crucial.

(sniff sniff... smells weird in here. Might have let something on the fire...)

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Re: 2019-2020 Stars Regular Season Thread

Postby Troy McClure » Thu Oct 17, 2019 10:54 am

Math wrote:
Troy McClure wrote: Here's the list of players drafted out of the QMJHL by the Stars:

2013 2nd round Desrosiers Goalie (Quebecois)
2011 5th round Vance D (American)
2006 1st round Vishnevskiy D (Russian)
2003 6th round Wathier LW (Ontario)
2002 1st round Vagner D (Czech)
2001 9th round Sullivan RW (Newfie)
1999 5th round Baumgartner RW (Austrian)
1995 2nd round Cote LW (Quebecois)
1995 5th round Marleau D (Quebecois)

Only nine players ever drafted out of the Q, and of those nine, only three are actually French Canadian.

Don't know what to take from this, but it sure seems like the Stars ignore the Q.


Yes, and I would say it's a major trend not only in the Stars' organization, but also around the league. There's less Quebecers that are drafted and make through the NHL on a regular basis, that pretty noticeable.

The league development and expansion come with a much wider player basin all across North America, trending up especially in former non-traditional markets. Dallas is one of the best example when you see the evolution between the early 90's and now. Moreover, there seem to be more interests towards European players where they used to be simply ignored. As a consequence, the fraction of Quebecers are decreasing, the pool of eligible players is much wider.

But my other hypothesis is related to the mental aspects of QC players towards, let's say Canadian in general. There's (and there will always be, even unconsciously) an inferiority or persecution complex coming from a looooong time ago, when the Brits kicked French's asses in the Plains of Abraham. Basically, nothing is their fault. When they are challenged, instead of listening to criticizm and work to improve, they will whine and complain. And I have the feeling that more and more scouting staff all across the league become somehow reluctant to consider a Quebecers vs. another player coming from elsewhere at equal value and skill.

I remember being in the press-box at a Quebec Remparts game. One Stars scout was next to me and came to see Anthony Duclair. Well, we probably saw the same thing: that guy was by far the best one ice, was the quickest, great vision, great hands, lot of potential, sometimes putting maybe too much sauce. However, one thing was lacking: he didn't have a brain. He got tickled a bit and totally lost it, trying to instigate fights before being sent off. Ok, Duclair-Stars, stikethrough.

Another symptomatic example I have is the game #7 between the Sharks and the Golden Knights with the famous 5' major that turned into four goals. Typical Québec reaction came from Marchessault (I'm pissed, refs robbed us, this is a scandal), barking indistinctly at everyone while other players took that on them (Yes It was a bad call, but allowing four goals during the penalty is unacceptable, it's on us). Of course they are not all like that, Marc-André Fleury or Marc-Antoine Vlasic for instance, but you can see a general pattern.

Sorry for the novel and eventual syntax and/or grammatical errors.

There is a bias obvious in NHL GMs. They all love their hard working western Canadians and if looking at two equal depth players, most every GM will take the western Canadian over a guy with a Quebecois or European accent.

I first noticed this when looking at the league's view of Russians. If you're a top flight Russian talent, the NHL will embrace you, but if you're a 3rd/4th line skill level, NHL GMs would rather just find a Canadian or American to do the job. The league seems to have come around more on using some Finns or Swedes for some grinder jobs, but those jobs still seem to be off limits for Russians or Czechs.
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Re: 2019-2020 Stars Regular Season Thread

Postby wonko80 » Thu Oct 17, 2019 10:54 am

The Dallas Stars have played eight games, tied for the most in the NHL thus far. They also have the 28th-most points and a 1-6-1 record.

It’s a deep hole the Stars will try to dig themselves out of with just under 90 percent of the season remaining.

If we use 93 points as the playoff cut line — that’s how many the Stars had as a wild-card team last season — Dallas would need to accumulate 90 points in their final 74 games. Realistically, that would require a record that would look something like 43-27-4 in the final 74 games.

That’s the equivalent of playing like a 100-point team for the remainder of the season. So the question becomes, can the Stars play like a top-five team in the league consistently starting Friday in Pittsburgh? The odds certainly aren’t in their favor.

I saw that as well and slumped my shoulders. The chances of them turning into a team that wins at that rate are very, very low. Sure, only 10% of the season is gone, but with how tight the races are, that's a large amount of points to make up. They have less points than many teams who have played 2-4 games less than them. That *poo poo* adds up quick once the end of the season gets here and you need 4 points to catch the wild card spot or whatever.

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Re: 2019-2020 Stars Regular Season Thread

Postby Jason » Thu Oct 17, 2019 12:17 pm


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Re: 2019-2020 Stars Regular Season Thread

Postby ToddM » Thu Oct 17, 2019 12:33 pm

The other thing about the QMJHL is that their offensive numbers are really, really inflated. Like, how good is Joe Veleno *really*?

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Re: 2019-2020 Stars Regular Season Thread

Postby wonko80 » Thu Oct 17, 2019 12:41 pm

Jason wrote:

Man, he really *poo poo* all over them, which they deserved.

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Re: 2019-2020 Stars Regular Season Thread

Postby Math » Thu Oct 17, 2019 12:55 pm

Could be somehow. Compared to the WHL and OHL, the LHJMQ is more offensive-minded whereas the two other leagues are much more physical. In St-John, Veleno was really dominant before being traded in Drummondville. He had a bit of a slump there before going back to his standards and be a powerful forward. But numbers don't tell the whole story.

Sven Andrighetto turned at about 2pt/game, sometimes even 2½ during the playoffs, comparable to what Crosby did in Rimouski. He was drafted in the 3rd round by Montréal, which I thought it was a real steal. However, he never played on a regular basis in the NHL -- going through the Candiens system didn't help either, they usually burn their prospects instead of developing them --, was given a second chance in Colorado and is now in the KHL.

Other guys like Mantha, KcKinnon, Radulov, Chabot, Letang, Marchand are well installed in the league now, some of them weren't really in the middle of the radar. Also, the two last winners of the Memorial Cup are two teams from the LJHMQ (Acadie-Bathurst and Rouyn-Noranda)

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Re: 2019-2020 Stars Regular Season Thread

Postby Troy McClure » Thu Oct 17, 2019 1:00 pm

On the last one, what he missed is the deepest player on defense was Hintz, so when he wonders why the defender doesn't just step up and stop Milano, well.... because the guy in the best position of the whole team to defend was the center. I'm not sure if that makes things worse or better, but his point is well taken that the forwards are all over the place. I noticed both Benn and Radulov behind the net before that first goal. No idea what they're doing.
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Re: 2019-2020 Stars Regular Season Thread

Postby ScubaSteve » Thu Oct 17, 2019 1:01 pm

Hintz was only back covering because Klingberg was god knows where.
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Re: 2019-2020 Stars Regular Season Thread

Postby Math » Thu Oct 17, 2019 1:11 pm

Troy McClure wrote:I noticed both Benn and Radulov behind the net before that first goal. No idea what they're doing.


That drove me nuts. The first goal is Bantam AA- level, almost everybody were out of position, not knowing anything. The Blue Jacket guy had time to prepare himself three expressos before taking the shot. And Fedun on that one, oh my...

All goals allowed came to inexusable indiviual errors with blackouts on top of it. And the Milano goal, the cherry on the top of the unreasonable sundae.

Hopefully they didn't talk about the PK. They opt for a tight square, fine. But damnit try at least to cut some pass lines and be aggressive on the puck holder, put at least the half of the 1/64 level of pressure on him, it won't be possible by putting slow and heavy guys like Sekera. Even Benn was on the PK which is the summit of absurdity. The Blue Jackets were very dangerous on every PP they got, even hitting the post twice.

That team surely can do better and start to get some wins, but the things will turn for sure bullshit by Monty quite scares me. "The definition of insanity is doing the same thing all over again and expect a different result" (Albert Einstein)

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Re: 2019-2020 Stars Regular Season Thread

Postby Troy McClure » Thu Oct 17, 2019 1:22 pm

The forwards running around kinda looks like guys trying too hard to do each other's jobs, so they're out there chasing the puck. But it always works to make the situation worse.
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Re: 2019-2020 Stars Regular Season Thread

Postby Math » Thu Oct 17, 2019 2:00 pm

ScubaSteve wrote:Hintz was only back covering because Klingberg was god knows where.


Making some camping in the offensive zone after his kamikaze rush, leading to the shameful GWG by Columbus, hence validating the Horseshift™ of the game.

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Re: 2019-2020 Stars Regular Season Thread

Postby ToddM » Thu Oct 17, 2019 2:38 pm

Troy McClure wrote:The forwards running around kinda looks like guys trying too hard to do each other's jobs, so they're out there chasing the puck. But it always works to make the situation worse.


Looked like a carbon copy of the way we played D under Gulutzan and Crawford. Lots of chasing, guys getting tired, goals going in.

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Re: 2019-2020 Stars Regular Season Thread

Postby BigAl » Thu Oct 17, 2019 2:46 pm

Lastly year when everyone was healthy they very rarely gave up breakaways and infrequently gave up odd man rushes. We’re back to giving up multiples per game.
Could of.

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Re: 2019-2020 Stars Regular Season Thread

Postby Troy McClure » Thu Oct 17, 2019 3:14 pm

BigAl wrote:Lastly year when everyone was healthy they very rarely gave up breakaways and infrequently gave up odd man rushes. We’re back to giving up multiples per game.

And that's what doesn't make sense. The guys *fargin'* up aren't the three new guys, so there's no excuse for confusion.
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Re: 2019-2020 Stars Regular Season Thread

Postby wonko80 » Thu Oct 17, 2019 3:18 pm

I'm fine (relatively) with Radulov *fargin'* up as he has never struck me as someone super concerned with defensive play. However, Benn was at one time a highly thought of penalty killer, so he should know what he's doing. Yet he's making the same *poo poo* ass plays in the d zone.

So it makes me wonder, is it actually coaching? Do they just suck at getting their message across?

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Re: 2019-2020 Stars Regular Season Thread

Postby BigAl » Thu Oct 17, 2019 3:44 pm

I think it starts with the defensemen in the offensive zone. I’ll have to pay a little more attention, but I think they’re too cavalier with joining the offense, pinching too deeply, and not paying enough attention to gap control.

Brent Severyn pointed out in one of the post game shows that the forwards are often in deep and not covering for the defensemen when they pinch down. That basically leaves one defenseman to cover if a jail break happens.
Could of.

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Re: 2019-2020 Stars Regular Season Thread

Postby Jason » Thu Oct 17, 2019 6:25 pm

Spoiler:
Image


Image

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Re: 2019-2020 Stars Regular Season Thread

Postby ToddM » Sat Oct 19, 2019 12:43 am

Weirdly enough, DaLLLLLas is not technically out of it. They've only had one game against a Central opponent so far, and if they can get a real coach before 10-29, when they really start digging in to their division, they could make up a lot of lost ground really quickly. Maybe even get their first regulation win of the season!

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Re: 2019-2020 Stars Regular Season Thread

Postby wonko80 » Sat Oct 19, 2019 9:36 am

Witnessing a second year, and even worse performance, of the Stars offense, it makes me actually start to wonder if Montgomery is not a good coach. Like surely there are other things you can try to change outside of line shuffling? To just give up and say it's all on the players and their effort, while I'm sure that is a factor, makes me wonder if he's too rigid with whatever his "system" is?

I don't know... it's always all speculation on our parts on this. But to have the team come out this year and have the same *poo poo* offense does not give me confidence in him as a coach.

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Re: 2019-2020 Stars Regular Season Thread

Postby ScubaSteve » Sat Oct 19, 2019 9:48 am

wonko80 wrote:Witnessing a second year, and even worse performance, of the Stars offense, it makes me actually start to wonder if Montgomery is not a good coach. Like surely there are other things you can try to change outside of line shuffling? To just give up and say it's all on the players and their effort, while I'm sure that is a factor, makes me wonder if he's too rigid with whatever his "system" is?

I don't know... it's always all speculation on our parts on this. But to have the team come out this year and have the same *poo poo* offense does not give me confidence in him as a coach.


They were honestly pretty bad for 2/3 of last season as well. They caught fire around February and rode that into the playoffs, but in retrospect maybe that had more to do with Vezina-worthy goaltending than skater talent or coaching.
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Re: 2019-2020 Stars Regular Season Thread

Postby SaintAngerBH » Sun Oct 20, 2019 3:55 pm

https://www.nhltraderumors.me/2019/10/nhltr-dallas-has-received-multiple.html?m=1

According to sources in contact with Stars management, the Stars have indeed been contacted by two teams regarding the structure of a Jamie Benn trade, the Carolina Hurricanes and the Montreal Canadiens.


The reddit soyboys think this is a bad thing.
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