2019 Stars Off-Season Thread

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slaps
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Re: 2019 Stars Off-Season Thread

Postby slaps » Tue Aug 27, 2019 11:29 am

I feel like this article best sums up my feelings on the Stars:

https://sports.yahoo.com/where-dallas-s ... 06483.html

Lambert basically says the offseason was fine, Pavelski was a good signing, and the Stars should be competitive, but they aren't an elite team that is legitimately in the Cup conversation.

One of the things I’ve seen a lot in the past couple of weeks is the idea that there’s some debate about whether the Dallas Stars should be considered Stanley Cup contenders. That seems a bit much considering they needed .929 goaltending to finish three points ahead of the cut line last season, but the persistence of these just-thinking-out-louds really makes me wonder.

We’ve heard a lot, for instance, about how they were a goal away from eliminating the Cup champions (albeit only in the second round). This is a very optimistic way to look at things, because I’m trying to remember if any other teams in recent years have famously been a goal away from eliminating the Cup champs and then underperformed collective expectations the following year. Can’t think of any.

Dallas obviously isn’t Ottawa. On paper, the Stars have a lot of the qualifications you need to be considered an elite team: Good (perhaps very good) coach, four high-end forwards, a couple of very good defencemen and a goalie who is often above average. That’s definitely going to put you in a position to compete.



That said, they did overperform last season and it got them to 93 points in what everyone acknowledges was a tough division. That division got even tougher over the summer, with Nashville adding offence, Colorado having probably the best off-season in the league, Chicago marginally improving, and Winnipeg maybe bouncing back. Also, St. Louis isn’t going to spend half the season in the toilet.

Where does that leave the Stars? Probably right around where they were last year, if we’re being honest. A good, and perhaps even very good team. But will they be great, or even elite? It’s not the most likely scenario.
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Re: 2019 Stars Off-Season Thread

Postby B Kat » Tue Aug 27, 2019 11:44 am

Not me, Cup or bust. :)

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Re: 2019 Stars Off-Season Thread

Postby SaintAngerBH » Tue Aug 27, 2019 11:53 am

Chicago is going to suck ass next year. But, the rest of the teams will definitely be tough to beat.
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Re: 2019 Stars Off-Season Thread

Postby Math » Tue Aug 27, 2019 12:45 pm

Overall I got the same feeling, even though linking the 3-pt difference only to the ,929 goaltending percentage is way too simplist. I barely see the top-6 struggling again.

A ton of potential, but some question marks about defense (well, overall) depth as the Stars still need a brilliant Bishop in front of the next (about average won't suffice in the playoffs).

Just enter the *Dang ol'* playoffs. Once you're in, everything is open, and screw the "home-ice advantage" bullshit, it's a non-factor: in the last five playoffs, home teams won between 47% and 53% of all games, and even game #7 winners tend to be equally distributed between home and visitor teams.

Chicago and Minnesota will be in the bottom. Given the tight Central division, 2 WCs could go to central teams. So the Stars could easily make the 1st part of the season in the toilet, save some energy, go under the radar in a submarine operation, and then go on winning streaks to end up winning the Cup. Sounds like a plan !

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Re: 2019 Stars Off-Season Thread

Postby The Frugal Gourmet » Tue Aug 27, 2019 12:45 pm

slaps wrote:I feel like this article best sums up my feelings on the Stars:

https://sports.yahoo.com/where-dallas-s ... 06483.html

Lambert basically says the offseason was fine, Pavelski was a good signing, and the Stars should be competitive, but they aren't an elite team that is legitimately in the Cup conversation.

One of the things I’ve seen a lot in the past couple of weeks is the idea that there’s some debate about whether the Dallas Stars should be considered Stanley Cup contenders. That seems a bit much considering they needed .929 goaltending to finish three points ahead of the cut line last season, but the persistence of these just-thinking-out-louds really makes me wonder.

We’ve heard a lot, for instance, about how they were a goal away from eliminating the Cup champions (albeit only in the second round). This is a very optimistic way to look at things, because I’m trying to remember if any other teams in recent years have famously been a goal away from eliminating the Cup champs and then underperformed collective expectations the following year. Can’t think of any.

Dallas obviously isn’t Ottawa. On paper, the Stars have a lot of the qualifications you need to be considered an elite team: Good (perhaps very good) coach, four high-end forwards, a couple of very good defencemen and a goalie who is often above average. That’s definitely going to put you in a position to compete.



That said, they did overperform last season and it got them to 93 points in what everyone acknowledges was a tough division. That division got even tougher over the summer, with Nashville adding offence, Colorado having probably the best off-season in the league, Chicago marginally improving, and Winnipeg maybe bouncing back. Also, St. Louis isn’t going to spend half the season in the toilet.

Where does that leave the Stars? Probably right around where they were last year, if we’re being honest. A good, and perhaps even very good team. But will they be great, or even elite? It’s not the most likely scenario.


False. The Stars were one bounce away from winning the Stanley Cup and are even closer now because Pavelski.

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Re: 2019 Stars Off-Season Thread

Postby slaps » Tue Aug 27, 2019 1:02 pm

Connor got a stuffed shark in red, white, and blue colors around the same time Pavelski signed here. I told Connor they call Pavelski "Captain America" and he named the shark Joe.

:gulp
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Re: 2019 Stars Off-Season Thread

Postby Troy McClure » Tue Aug 27, 2019 1:45 pm

Their biggest problem last season was scoring goals, and they added a very good goal scorer. They also cut bait on some dead weight on the 4th line. They didn't go and make massive improvements, but addressing weaknesses is a good thing. If everything works out, they should be a playoff team again.
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Re: 2019 Stars Off-Season Thread

Postby slaps » Tue Aug 27, 2019 2:00 pm

I see a lot of "hope Hintz is actually a legit top-6 player" type of issues. However, I think that's probably a better way to go than a roster full of overpaid, old, and slow veterans.
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Re: 2019 Stars Off-Season Thread

Postby Troy McClure » Tue Aug 27, 2019 2:01 pm

slaps wrote:I see a lot of "hope Hintz is actually a legit top-6 player" type of issues. However, I think that's probably a better way to go than a roster full of overpaid, old, and slow veterans.

Adding a full season of fully operational Hintz is another upgrade over last season.
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Re: 2019 Stars Off-Season Thread

Postby SaintAngerBH » Tue Aug 27, 2019 2:17 pm

That's assuming he doesn't go the way of Janmark.
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Re: 2019 Stars Off-Season Thread

Postby slaps » Tue Aug 27, 2019 3:00 pm

Fabiann Brunnstrom was going to be the next Pavel Bure, let's not forget.
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Re: 2019 Stars Off-Season Thread

Postby SaintAngerBH » Tue Aug 27, 2019 3:28 pm

slaps wrote:Fabiann Brunnstrom was going to be the next Pavel Bure, let's not forget.


He kind of was. For a game.
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Re: 2019 Stars Off-Season Thread

Postby The Frugal Gourmet » Wed Aug 28, 2019 11:20 am

Troy McClure wrote:Their biggest problem last season was scoring goals, and they added a very good goal scorer. They also cut bait on some dead weight on the 4th line. They didn't go and make massive improvements, but addressing weaknesses is a good thing. If everything works out, they should be a playoff team again.


Despite the bit about one bounce away, I felt we actually got stronger towards the end instead of our traditional fade. So I'm truly more optimistic than usual w/ this style and system.

But, you never really know anything until you see the games.

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Re: 2019 Stars Off-Season Thread

Postby Troy McClure » Wed Aug 28, 2019 12:31 pm

The Frugal Gourmet wrote:
Troy McClure wrote:Their biggest problem last season was scoring goals, and they added a very good goal scorer. They also cut bait on some dead weight on the 4th line. They didn't go and make massive improvements, but addressing weaknesses is a good thing. If everything works out, they should be a playoff team again.


Despite the bit about one bounce away, I felt we actually got stronger towards the end instead of our traditional fade. So I'm truly more optimistic than usual w/ this style and system.

But, you never really know anything until you see the games.

They did. Even though he got hurt right away, the team overall looked better following the Zuccarello trade. Kind of like it injected some confidence. A guy like Comeau was far more productive those last six weeks than he was the previous part of the season.
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Re: 2019 Stars Off-Season Thread

Postby slaps » Wed Aug 28, 2019 12:45 pm

The ability to score goals and "think" the game at a high level is a skill. It's a skill that most forwards on the Stars don't possess. Seguin does, and Pavelski does. Guys like Benn and to some degree Comeau can't think the game like a Seguin or Pavelski, but they can finish off the setups from them. Adding guys who can think the game at an elite level, such as Zuccarello, has a trickle-down effect throughout the lineup.
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Re: 2019 Stars Off-Season Thread

Postby wonko80 » Wed Aug 28, 2019 12:48 pm

I believe Benn thinks the game well, especially when he doesn't have the puck. His problem when he has the puck is he consistently waits one second too long and gets it taken away. But he often makes a great move right before that to get to open space, then just doesn't commit to using that extra space to move it or shoot it.

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Re: 2019 Stars Off-Season Thread

Postby wonko80 » Wed Aug 28, 2019 12:51 pm

To your point though, the "thinking the game well" is what intrigues me about Jason Robertson. I thought he was just a pure scorer, but reading more on him he's also a really good play maker, which this team desperately needs.

That was really one of the most disappointing things about Nichushkin. His first year or two he seemed like a good play maker with some of the passes he'd make to open guys in the zone, but man, that sure went away. Maybe once his skating wasn't as good post injury he couldn't create the space to look for those plays.

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Re: 2019 Stars Off-Season Thread

Postby ScubaSteve » Wed Aug 28, 2019 12:51 pm

Troy McClure wrote:
The Frugal Gourmet wrote:
Troy McClure wrote:Their biggest problem last season was scoring goals, and they added a very good goal scorer. They also cut bait on some dead weight on the 4th line. They didn't go and make massive improvements, but addressing weaknesses is a good thing. If everything works out, they should be a playoff team again.


Despite the bit about one bounce away, I felt we actually got stronger towards the end instead of our traditional fade. So I'm truly more optimistic than usual w/ this style and system.

But, you never really know anything until you see the games.

They did. Even though he got hurt right away, the team overall looked better following the Zuccarello trade. Kind of like it injected some confidence. A guy like Comeau was far more productive those last six weeks than he was the previous part of the season.


Yeah, as late as February I was convinced that this team sucked and everyone should be fired/traded.
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Re: 2019 Stars Off-Season Thread

Postby wonko80 » Wed Aug 28, 2019 12:56 pm

Okay, I think this is kinda funny that the Stars have a quote about having high expectations for this season and showing Seguin playing golf.

Golftakesapriority.png
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Re: 2019 Stars Off-Season Thread

Postby BigAl » Wed Aug 28, 2019 1:11 pm

wonko80 wrote:That was really one of the most disappointing things about Nichushkin. His first year or two he seemed like a good play maker with some of the passes he'd make to open guys in the zone, but man, that sure went away. Maybe once his skating wasn't as good post injury he couldn't create the space to look for those plays.

This is kind of a suspicion of mine, too. Occasionally he got praised for his ability to protect the puck in the offensive zone, but I think the reason he did that was because he couldn’t think up anything better to do.
Could of.

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Re: 2019 Stars Off-Season Thread

Postby The Frugal Gourmet » Wed Aug 28, 2019 2:18 pm

wonko80 wrote:Okay, I think this is kinda funny that the Stars have a quote about having high expectations for this season and showing Seguin playing golf.

Golftakesapriority.png


That also showed up on my Facebook wall, and I lol'ed.

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Re: 2019 Stars Off-Season Thread

Postby slaps » Wed Aug 28, 2019 2:23 pm

wonko80 wrote:I believe Benn thinks the game well, especially when he doesn't have the puck. His problem when he has the puck is he consistently waits one second too long and gets it taken away. But he often makes a great move right before that to get to open space, then just doesn't commit to using that extra space to move it or shoot it.


I think Benn is (or used to be) really good at getting open, and has / had a wicked wrist shot. As long as he had someone who could get him the puck, it was likely going to be a goal. I don't think he thinks the game in an elite playmaking way, though.
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Re: 2019 Stars Off-Season Thread

Postby slaps » Wed Aug 28, 2019 2:24 pm

wonko80 wrote:To your point though, the "thinking the game well" is what intrigues me about Jason Robertson. I thought he was just a pure scorer, but reading more on him he's also a really good play maker, which this team desperately needs.


That's probably my biggest objection to the Stars' drafting. They go for the safe pick that projects to be a 3rd-line guy. That's fine here and there, but they need to take a swing at guys who have the mental ability to do the hockey at an elite level.
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Re: 2019 Stars Off-Season Thread

Postby ScubaSteve » Wed Aug 28, 2019 4:00 pm

“Thinking the game well” is a euphemism for not physically gifted. Spezza is slow, but he still has great hockey sense!
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Re: 2019 Stars Off-Season Thread

Postby slaps » Wed Aug 28, 2019 4:49 pm

It is when its used an excuse. But you can't tell me a guy like Seguin or Heiskanen or DeBrincat or Brayden Point don't see the game and the ice at vastly different level than Comeau or Dickinson. And not every player is going to be like that, but the Stars default to going for the Comeau / Dickinson guy at the draft when they should be trying for the DeBrincat / Point guy.
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Re: 2019 Stars Off-Season Thread

Postby ScubaSteve » Wed Aug 28, 2019 5:18 pm

They do, but they’re never described that way. You just call them “good.”
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Re: 2019 Stars Off-Season Thread

Postby slaps » Wed Aug 28, 2019 5:54 pm

Possibly even above average.
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Re: 2019 Stars Off-Season Thread

Postby SaintAngerBH » Wed Aug 28, 2019 6:01 pm

Comeau was an offensive force before the NHL. So was Steve Ott.

I'm always confused by guys like that who suddenly can't score at all in the NHL. Is the NHL game really that different?
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Re: 2019 Stars Off-Season Thread

Postby slaps » Wed Aug 28, 2019 6:28 pm

It's not different, it just moves so much faster. It's a common theme with players - in the AHL, they have so much extra time to think about what to do, where to go, etc. In the NHL, they get the puck and there is a guy on them almost instantly.
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Re: 2019 Stars Off-Season Thread

Postby wonko80 » Thu Aug 29, 2019 10:43 am

This was a fun video. Crazy that they could field almost an entire roster with just Finnish ex/current Stars players.


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