2017-2018 Stars Season Thread

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BigAl
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Re: 2017-2018 Stars Season Thread

Postby BigAl » Mon Mar 26, 2018 9:04 am

Troy McClure wrote:
BigAl wrote:With no cap room, who could he have added?

They had the cap room to add a player.

By the time they got to the deadline they only had 500k left. Maybe they could have rented a third liner, at best.
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Re: 2017-2018 Stars Season Thread

Postby slaps » Mon Mar 26, 2018 9:12 am

BigAl wrote:
slaps wrote:He could have shut down Hanzal earlier (or not signed him). LTIR gives you a permitted overage on the cap, and since salaries are pro-rated, he should have been able to fit in someone with a comparable cap hit.

I would agree with not signing him in the first place, but they did. And then whatever doctors they were using kept clearing him to play until after after the trade deadline. There was no way Nill could’ve been happy with the state of the team, but at that point his only option was to polish the turd as best he could.


The Stars had almost $4.1MM in cap space at the deadline.

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Re: 2017-2018 Stars Season Thread

Postby BigAl » Mon Mar 26, 2018 9:24 am

slaps wrote:
BigAl wrote:
slaps wrote:He could have shut down Hanzal earlier (or not signed him). LTIR gives you a permitted overage on the cap, and since salaries are pro-rated, he should have been able to fit in someone with a comparable cap hit.

I would agree with not signing him in the first place, but they did. And then whatever doctors they were using kept clearing him to play until after after the trade deadline. There was no way Nill could’ve been happy with the state of the team, but at that point his only option was to polish the turd as best he could.


The Stars had almost $4.1MM in cap space at the deadline.

Dammit, could have sworn it was much less. NEVERMIND.
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Re: 2017-2018 Stars Season Thread

Postby slaps » Mon Mar 26, 2018 12:20 pm

So really, just full on *f-bomb* Hitchcock.

https://www.nhl.com/stars/news/dallas-s ... -297320428

As for the final six games, two of which are at home this week against Philadelphia on Tuesday and Minnesota on Saturday, Hitchcock admitted he will look at lineup changes. He's got options with youngsters Gemel Smith, Dillon Heatherington and Julius Honka all possibilities in terms of shaking it up.

"I think we've got to look at everything. I think we've got to look at the energy, we've got to look at everything," Hitchcock said.

But when asked if journeyman backup Mike McKenna, called up from the American Hockey League with Ben Bishop sidelined indefinitely, might get a look, Hitchcock was noncommittal.

"I don't want to go that far, I don't want to get into that," the coach said.

At this stage, could it really hurt?

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Re: 2017-2018 Stars Season Thread

Postby ToddM » Mon Mar 26, 2018 12:26 pm

Eight losses in a row is pretty bad, but NINE?!?! Holy *poo poo*, that would be AWFUL.

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Re: 2017-2018 Stars Season Thread

Postby Jason » Mon Mar 26, 2018 12:34 pm

The Stars need 14 losses in a row, get it done.

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Re: 2017-2018 Stars Season Thread

Postby Troy McClure » Mon Mar 26, 2018 12:35 pm

Conspiracy time: I'm convinced Modano only agreed to show up to the 25th anniversary stuff when it became clear the Stars were missing the playoffs.

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Re: 2017-2018 Stars Season Thread

Postby Troy McClure » Mon Mar 26, 2018 12:35 pm

Jason wrote:The Stars need 14 losses in a row, get it done.

Would they even move two draft spots if they lost out?
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Re: 2017-2018 Stars Season Thread

Postby Jason » Mon Mar 26, 2018 1:01 pm

Troy McClure wrote:
Jason wrote:The Stars need 14 losses in a row, get it done.

Would they even move two draft spots if they lost out?


Kings 76 GP 89 points would pick 15th (final non playoff spot)

Stars 76 GP 84 points (Currently would pick 14th)

Best options to pass would be
Panthers 83 points (73 GP)
Flames 80 points (76 GP)
Carolina 77 points (75 GP)

As for lottery last year the Flyers moved from 13th to 2nd. The odds are a little different this year.

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Re: 2017-2018 Stars Season Thread

Postby Troy McClure » Mon Mar 26, 2018 1:26 pm

Wonko said something to me about Kari's stats over this run, so I looked them up.

During this losing streak, Kari has given up more goals against than any other goalie for a very ugly 3.54 GAA and his save percentage is an abysmal 0.881.
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Re: 2017-2018 Stars Season Thread

Postby ScubaSteve » Mon Mar 26, 2018 1:31 pm

Despite the fake news narrative that Kari has been great this season, I think we can conclude that this thing was officially over once Bishop got hurt.
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Re: 2017-2018 Stars Season Thread

Postby B Kat » Mon Mar 26, 2018 1:44 pm

I'd like to be convinced that it was only the Bishop injury. But even before that the Stars didn't have the ability to ramp up or clamp down when necessary. Bishop made a ton of saves and got wins the team may not have deserved. Then he would give up a bunch of softies the next game. So while he was much better, Bishop was also very inconsistent.

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Re: 2017-2018 Stars Season Thread

Postby Jason » Mon Mar 26, 2018 1:52 pm

ScubaSteve wrote:Despite the fake news narrative that Kari has been great this season, I think we can conclude that this thing was officially over once Bishop got hurt.


It was crumbling way before that point. Started in the game in Chicago when Hanzal went down, sure they won that game then against Pittsburgh the next night. The team has been terrible for the majority of the games since.

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Re: 2017-2018 Stars Season Thread

Postby SaintAngerBH » Mon Mar 26, 2018 3:11 pm

Jason wrote:
Troy McClure wrote:
Jason wrote:The Stars need 14 losses in a row, get it done.

Would they even move two draft spots if they lost out?


Kings 76 GP 89 points would pick 15th (final non playoff spot)

Stars 76 GP 84 points (Currently would pick 14th)

Best options to pass would be
Panthers 83 points (73 GP)
Flames 80 points (76 GP)
Carolina 77 points (75 GP)

As for lottery last year the Flyers moved from 13th to 2nd. The odds are a little different this year.


They should tank all remaining games, for sure.
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Re: 2017-2018 Stars Season Thread

Postby #JTONTFJTGM » Mon Mar 26, 2018 3:49 pm

B Kat wrote:I'd like to be convinced that it was only the Bishop injury. But even before that the Stars didn't have the ability to ramp up or clamp down when necessary. Bishop made a ton of saves and got wins the team may not have deserved. Then he would give up a bunch of softies the next game. So while he was much better, Bishop was also very inconsistent.

He's 16th in the league in goals against average and 21st in save percentage on a team that's currently 10th in goals against average and was fourth when he got hurt the first time on March 5th.

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Re: 2017-2018 Stars Season Thread

Postby Knives Out » Tue Mar 27, 2018 2:33 am

The Stars played the season just like they played their games: pretty good until the end.
That Hanzal's so hurt right now.

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Re: 2017-2018 Stars Season Thread

Postby jonathanswede » Tue Mar 27, 2018 4:54 am

Easiest way is to blame Kari... but I think its much more... I´ve seen all these loosing streak games and I am right now a very disappointed fan. There are some bad luck in this off course, but I think the Stars played a more fun hockey for two years ago. Here are some wonderings.

1. ON PRESSURE
Why does everybody keep Ising the puck when pressured in the own zone? Where are the short smart passes? Is it a Hitchcook thing not to dare take chances in your own zone and always play safe? Or is it only bad confidence? Playing shut-down game when leading could not be to waste pucks all over... Its awfully boring to watch also.

2. OFFENCE
I like to see more shorter passes, playing more side to side. Now its always putting the puck straight up, and that seems like a very easy play to read. The plays resulting in offence are so rare... Also I like to see more people to follow on counterattacks, not playing safe all the time.

3. Why does Klingberg always end up as last man in front of the own goal. Its strange, where is the other defender ? Isn't Klingberg best used when he is on the offensive side of the game?

Overall I think the Stars energy got a little bit lost this year. Two years ago this team could turn a 0-3 to a 5-3 win with lots of energy, smartness and finess. It also ended up in total losses sometimes, but it was very fun to watch, always knowing there could be a chance to win.

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Re: 2017-2018 Stars Season Thread

Postby B Kat » Tue Mar 27, 2018 6:44 am

You’re right, those past Stars teams were a lot more fun to watch, even last season.

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Re: 2017-2018 Stars Season Thread

Postby slaps » Tue Mar 27, 2018 7:46 am

This THN article really plays nicely into my "*f-bomb* Nill" stance:

http://www.thehockeynews.com/news/artic ... turnaround

Given San Jose was barely hanging onto second spot in the Pacific Division with a narrow two-point edge over the final wild-card seed in the Western Conference at the trade deadline, few would have been surprised to see Sharks stand pat. After all, this was an aging group with an increasingly thin prospect pool that had taken their shot at Stanley Cup glory only two years prior, so a regroup of sorts would have made all the sense in the world.

Sharks GM Doug Wilson, however, thought differently. He appeared to be of the mind that there was still tread left on these tires, that a close race in a seemingly wide-open division gave San Jose every reason to dip into the trade waters, so he reached in and pulled a pair of moves out of his hat. The first was seemingly inconsequential, a low-risk gamble that saw the Sharks send a sixth-round pick in 2020 draft to the Toronto Maple Leafs for veteran winger Eric Fehr, but the second was a splash as San Jose acquired one of the deadline’s biggest fish, power forward Evander Kane, from the Buffalo Sabres in exchange for Daniel O’Regan, a conditional first-round pick in 2019 and a 2020 fourth-round selection.

To some, the deals may have seemed ill-timed, a shot at staying in a race that San Jose had next to chance at really winning. The reasons for that, of course, was as much about the team’s standing as of the deadline as it was about who wasn’t in the lineup when the end of February rolled around. In late-January, Sharks pivot Joe Thornton suffered an ugly looking knee injury, and the loss was one that seemed to shift the feelings surrounding San Jose’s season. In losing Thornton, the Sharks were forced to live life without their top-line pivot, second-highest scorer and an integral part of their otherwise mediocre offense. San Jose had also been nothing more than average in the time since Thornton hit the shelf: 26-14-7 with him in the lineup, the Sharks proceeded to go 7-7-2 without the veteran entering the deadline and were on a three-game skid when Wilson pulled the trigger on the Kane acquisition.

Never underestimate what a couple of fresh faces can do for a team, however, because a Sharks team that once looked as though it may be as good as dead in the water now has all the signs of entering the post-season as a quiet contender to win the Pacific.


That all sounds so very familiar, except for the winning and the good GM.

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Re: 2017-2018 Stars Season Thread

Postby ToddM » Tue Mar 27, 2018 7:50 am

Dallas would be comfortably in 2nd place if they played in the Pacific, too. Not all that impressed with San Jose's wins over the shittiest division in hockey.

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Re: 2017-2018 Stars Season Thread

Postby Troy McClure » Tue Mar 27, 2018 8:06 am

jonathanswede wrote:1. ON PRESSURE
Why does everybody keep Ising the puck when pressured in the own zone? Where are the short smart passes? Is it a Hitchcook thing not to dare take chances in your own zone and always play safe? Or is it only bad confidence? Playing shut-down game when leading could not be to waste pucks all over... Its awfully boring to watch also.

Hitch killed the fun transition game by having everyone focus on defense. Some better defensive play was needed, but Hitch seems to have gone too far the other way.

jonathanswede wrote:2. OFFENCE
I like to see more shorter passes, playing more side to side. Now its always putting the puck straight up, and that seems like a very easy play to read. The plays resulting in offence are so rare... Also I like to see more people to follow on counterattacks, not playing safe all the time.

I think this is a combo of Hitch and the personnel. Pateryn, Hamhuis, Lindell, and Methot are all guys who aren't making creative exit passes. They're pushing the puck up the boards, which leads to a transition game that takes place up the boards. Also, Hitch doesn't seem to want his guys getting cute in the neutral zone, so they're trying to get the puck up the outside of the ice where they enter the zone way out wide or dump it in. Either way, these guys are playing from the outside of the rink in the offensive zone.
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Re: 2017-2018 Stars Season Thread

Postby mookie1010 » Tue Mar 27, 2018 8:16 am

slaps wrote:This THN article really plays nicely into my "*f-bomb* Nill" stance:

http://www.thehockeynews.com/news/artic ... turnaround

Given San Jose was barely hanging onto second spot in the Pacific Division with a narrow two-point edge over the final wild-card seed in the Western Conference at the trade deadline, few would have been surprised to see Sharks stand pat. After all, this was an aging group with an increasingly thin prospect pool that had taken their shot at Stanley Cup glory only two years prior, so a regroup of sorts would have made all the sense in the world.

Sharks GM Doug Wilson, however, thought differently. He appeared to be of the mind that there was still tread left on these tires, that a close race in a seemingly wide-open division gave San Jose every reason to dip into the trade waters, so he reached in and pulled a pair of moves out of his hat. The first was seemingly inconsequential, a low-risk gamble that saw the Sharks send a sixth-round pick in 2020 draft to the Toronto Maple Leafs for veteran winger Eric Fehr, but the second was a splash as San Jose acquired one of the deadline’s biggest fish, power forward Evander Kane, from the Buffalo Sabres in exchange for Daniel O’Regan, a conditional first-round pick in 2019 and a 2020 fourth-round selection.

To some, the deals may have seemed ill-timed, a shot at staying in a race that San Jose had next to chance at really winning. The reasons for that, of course, was as much about the team’s standing as of the deadline as it was about who wasn’t in the lineup when the end of February rolled around. In late-January, Sharks pivot Joe Thornton suffered an ugly looking knee injury, and the loss was one that seemed to shift the feelings surrounding San Jose’s season. In losing Thornton, the Sharks were forced to live life without their top-line pivot, second-highest scorer and an integral part of their otherwise mediocre offense. San Jose had also been nothing more than average in the time since Thornton hit the shelf: 26-14-7 with him in the lineup, the Sharks proceeded to go 7-7-2 without the veteran entering the deadline and were on a three-game skid when Wilson pulled the trigger on the Kane acquisition.

Never underestimate what a couple of fresh faces can do for a team, however, because a Sharks team that once looked as though it may be as good as dead in the water now has all the signs of entering the post-season as a quiet contender to win the Pacific.


That all sounds so very familiar, except for the winning and the good GM.


Counterpoint / Devils advocate:

No rental or truly available player was gonna make us competitive with Nashville/Vegas/Winnipeg this season. Did we really just want the moral victory of a one and done playoff appearance? Because even if we'd gone .500 on that last road trip, we'd still be a point behind STL for 10th...
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Re: 2017-2018 Stars Season Thread

Postby Troy McClure » Tue Mar 27, 2018 8:26 am

I bet Tom Gaglardi would have liked the monetary victory of a playoff appearance.
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Re: 2017-2018 Stars Season Thread

Postby B Kat » Tue Mar 27, 2018 8:31 am

Yes, I would have been happy with the one and done in the playoffs. But I don’t necessarily think that adding one player at the deadline would have accomplished that. Stars have a lot of issues.

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Re: 2017-2018 Stars Season Thread

Postby slaps » Tue Mar 27, 2018 12:15 pm

I don't understand this defense of sitting tight at the deadline because "one guy wouldn't have won us a Cup" or similar logic. It's building blocks that get you to where you need to be. And a guy like Kane or Maroon can help with that.

But also, for fucks sake, I just want to watch playoff hockey involving the Stars.

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Re: 2017-2018 Stars Season Thread

Postby B Kat » Tue Mar 27, 2018 12:24 pm

I'm not saying I didn't want to add that one guy. I'm sure that one guy might have helped. But that the Stars are deficit in some other ways that one guy isn't going to fix.

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Re: 2017-2018 Stars Season Thread

Postby SaintAngerBH » Tue Mar 27, 2018 12:26 pm

slaps wrote:I don't understand this defense of sitting tight at the deadline because "one guy wouldn't have won us a Cup" or similar logic. It's building blocks that get you to where you need to be. And a guy like Kane or Maroon can help with that.

But also, for fucks sake, I just want to watch playoff hockey involving the Stars.


Exactly. Jim Nill should have looked at this team and gone: "Huh, we aren't good enough, let's add some pieces since we are supposed to be in win-now mode."

At least put some *fargin'* effort into it.

Nill is a bad GM. There, I said it.
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Re: 2017-2018 Stars Season Thread

Postby mookie1010 » Tue Mar 27, 2018 12:56 pm

slaps wrote:I don't understand this defense of sitting tight at the deadline because "one guy wouldn't have won us a Cup" or similar logic. It's building blocks that get you to where you need to be. And a guy like Kane or Maroon can help with that.

But also, for fucks sake, I just want to watch playoff hockey involving the Stars.

I guess the caveat is that a rental isn't worth what it probably would have cost. Adding a long or even medium term piece would change the devil's advocate argument.

My real opinion is that doing nothing was just another of Nill's bad decisions. When I look at Lehtonen, Niemi, Spezza etc and see what that's doing to the cap, it's ridic. I know someone listed his signings and rated them, but literally Radulov and the Sequin trade are the only real wins I can think of off the top of my head. Not firing Ruff last season, thinking that Hitch was an actual answer.....man. It's not a good track record.

Looking back now, the only way the Hitch hiring made sense is if he had a longer term plan that saw 17-18 to be the transition year where the forwards learn defensive responsibility and then get an expanded offensive role in 18-19 under Barnes or something. But that's far fetched.
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Re: 2017-2018 Stars Season Thread

Postby Troy McClure » Tue Mar 27, 2018 1:06 pm

What you don't want to do is give up picks to get NHL players because you need to have those picks for Nill to screw up.
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Re: 2017-2018 Stars Season Thread

Postby Jason » Tue Mar 27, 2018 1:44 pm

The handling of Honka is exactly how Tippett did with Eriksson, until Jackson stepped in (after Armstrong was fired) and forced him to play him.

Nill has said before he's going to let the coach make the lineup decisions. Nill puts the players on the roster, the coach doesn't play them. Which is why the players values drop like a rock, and are sold off for a bag of pucks. Then do better elsewhere, since they are given a chance to play game in game out. Not be focused on one mistake is going to take them out of the lineup. At least in this case the coach is senile, who loves prehistoric defenseman.

Same defense again tonight, Dickinson on 4th line, Spezza might play. I hope the Flyers win like 10-0.

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